Could you comment on the new official GBC resolution permiting first time in history of any vaisnava sampradaya females to award diksa initiations?

Manidhara Das

07 Sep 2022

3 Comments

As much I usually don't comment in public on any ISKCON issues of today, but try to the best of my abilities in this web side to present Srila Prabhupadas policies and instructions instead, the audacity and arrogance with which female diksa was officially installed as general and public policy in ISKCON calls for open resistance.

Being not an academically educated pundit, I leave it to my far more advanced godbrothers and their disciples to defeat this entirely feministicaly inspired decision.
Surely, the already us westerners doubting representatives of other Vaisnava sampradayas in India must see their doubts confirmed when such mlechas, saved by the mercy of Srila Prabhupada, reveal their ignorance about the standards been maintained for centuries in such Vaisnava branches. Surely this further degradation of Srila Prabhupadas heritage will bring new ISKCON- defecting members of the various Gaudia Math branches where such deviation is inconceivable.
What is most upsetting to me, an unworthy disciple of A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, the audacity and arrogance of all who worked persistently on the realization of this official GBC resolution.

Why didn't Srila Prabhupada who praised so many times the service of his female disciples NOT EVEN ONCE?
Installed any females in managerial positions as temple presidents or GBCs? Why none of their names appeared on his list of the STARTING diksa succession of new diksa gurus in ISKCON?

Did His Divine Grace forget something? Obviously our ISKCON innovators think so.
Smarter as the Founder Acharya they claim their arrogant assumptions being products of "new times" which call for new measures.
It is exactly in this way sampradyas fall apart to such degree that Krsna Himself has to appear to re-establish them again.

Some may argue, and the GBC resolution indicates that, that the female diksa in ISKCON will be of minor importance and even the individual temple presidents may be free to judge if they permit such gurudevis to preach in their zones or places or not.
Certainly, birds of the same feather flock together and so the new gurudevis may attract those bona fide vaisnavas avoid.
But this is a matter of principle and not a matter of individual decision.
Here the Founder Acharya is declared to be a fool. A fool to be corrected. This capital offence will bring misfortune upon anybody who takes part in it either actively or passively.
And so I dare to give here publicly in writing that I protest when my spiritual master is offended in this way.
As Srila Prabhupada exposed the feministic plot to be the work of the men, those female bodied devotees who fall prey for such a USA-bred propaganda simply prove Srila Prabhupadas point that women are indeed less intelligent.
Leaving their honorable service as advising mature mathajis these foolish victims of male propaganda climb the vyasasanas to initiate those who are as less-intelligent as they are.
This text is written by somebody who could write a considerably thick book about the amazing service he saw mathajis perform in the last fifty years when managing them as sankirtan leader and temple president. To see them, to disgrace themselves to be part of a Kali Yuga inspired feminist plot is a sad sight indeed.

When my spiritual master becomes offended in this way by some "smartheads", (Srila Prabhupada used to call such speculators "men with a fertile brain"), I have no other choice as to raise my voice and avoid any place where such offence is facilitated.

Manidhara das. ACBSP

3 Comments

Bhakta dasa

08 Sep 2022

Dear Prabhu,

Please accept my dandavats at your feet. All glory to His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada!

As we all are acutely aware the drive to divide the family is very strong across the world today. The constant ridicule of society headed by men by all media, and educational institutions, has made the masses believe in everything that is the antithesis to the eternal Vedic culture. Sadly, many of the claimed followers of His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada ignore his plain instructions to implement the VEDIC VARNA ASHRAMA SYSTEM in the society he began in 1966.

His Divine Grace always quoted Manu on the rules for a soul trapped in the body of a woman to NEVER be independent of her father, husband, or senior son. He repeated this over and over.

Indeed his books and conversations elaborate extensively on the duties of women.

Never once did His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada choose any woman to be a temple president, GBC, or even head cook in a temple. He also explained that a woman CANNOT take sanyass ever.

And of course His Divine Grace was revolted by the very thought of homosexuality. He wrote that is it demonic.

Yet today, popular opinion is that there is no difference between the male and female, and a male can be a female or a female can be a male if they choose! It is a world gone beyond any insanity I could have dreamed.

Sadly, most people who joined Iskcon have not been to or spent hardly any time in India learning the culture at all, although in India it is also being more corrupted by the day. Nevertheless bits of it exist, and in some places it is still strong.

IMHO, from the day His Divine Grace left our vision in 1977, Kali entered his society and from that point the deviations from the shastra have grown continually. It is very sad, as this movement was to save the entire world, but now it has joined the world.

Mahaprasadam Das

13 Sep 2022

Totally agree . Welcome to the ISKCON jungle . Ys Mahaprasadam Das

Paramananda das

20 Dec 2022

Chapter 2 of Vaisnava amrta
Female leaders in ISKCON !
Srila Prabhupada was very clear about women leaders:

Television Interview -- July 9, 1975, Chicago
Woman reporter: There is one question I have for you. You say that a woman’s brain is smaller than a man’s.

Prabhupada: Woman?

Nitai: Woman’s brain is smaller than a man’s brain.

Prabhupada: Yes, that is a fact. In the history there is no woman who is a big philosopher, a big mathematician, big scientist, big educationist. We don’t find. They were all men.

Woman reporter: What about women who are leaders of countries such as your own country?

Prabhupada: Well, according to Vedic conception woman is never offered leadership. But experience has shown that woman’s leadership has not been successful.

Woman reporter: Do you think Mrs. Gandhi’s leadership has not been successful?

Prabhupada: Well, there is already trouble. There are many big, big men, they do not agree with her and she has taken emergency steps. So on the whole, the country is in trouble.

Woman reporter: What about Mrs. Meir, president of Israel?

Prabhupada: I do not say of any particular woman, but according to Vedic civilization, we have never seen in the history that woman has become a leader.

Woman reporter: Women have been leaders.

Prabhupada: They were not selected. The leader–formerly it was monarchy–the monarchs were selected by the advisory board of the first-class men. So they never selected any woman to become the leader of the society.

Woman reporter: What about women who are elected by the people?

Prabhupada: Well, people election… Just like you elected Nixon and then you wanted him to come down. So this kind of election has no value. Sometimes you elect and sometimes you pull down. So what is the value of this election?

Woman reporter: So a leader should not be elected.

Prabhupada: Elected, but not by this general public. They have no intelligence. They sometimes elect a wrong man, and again they try to drag him down. So what is the use of such election? Because that election is not sober, not mature. If the election was mature and sober, then there was no need of dragging him down again.

Woman reporter: We have talked to scientists who say that the size of the brain has nothing to do with intelligence. Do you believe that?

Prabhupada: I think that the scientists do not think like that. They keep the brain of a particular scientist to study. They keep the heart of a particular noble man. Why they try to study the heart and the brain if there is no difference?

Nitai: Sometimes they keep the brain of a great scientist to study because they think that he is so intelligent, there must be something we can learn from studying the brain. So if they are thinking like that, then there also must be a difference between a woman’s brain and a man’s brain.

Woman reporter: What they say is that there is difference, but it has nothing to do with the size.

Nitai: Then why do they keep great scientists’ brain to study?

Woman reporter: They keep many people’s brains to study.

Nitai: Especially great scientists, that they want to see what has made this man so intelligent.

Woman reporter: That’s not necessarily true.

Prabhupada: Then why they study the brain? What is the purpose of studying brain unless there is difference? You study different brains. Unless you feel that there is difference between this brain and that brain, why do you study. What is the meaning of study?

Woman reporter: To find differences among men. It’s not necessarily differences between men and woman.

Prabhupada: I don’t say man or woman. But I say you study different brains–why? Unless you think there is some difference?

Woman reporter: There is difference.

Prabhupada: Yes. So if there is difference, then what is the harm if there is difference between man and woman’s brain?

Woman reporter: They say there isn’t.

Prabhupada: They say, but the fact we have to study. As soon as you study the construction of different brain, then you must know that there is difference, different activities.

Woman reporter: In other words, you do not believe this, what they say.

Prabhupada: Then why do you study different brain?

Woman reporter: I don’t study them. I’m just telling you what the scientists say.

Prabhupada: So scientists, the psychologist… As I was a student of psychology and our professor, a big man, Dr. W. S. Urquhart, he said that “By studying the brains of man and woman, we have found the highest brain substance found in man, sixty-four ounce by weight.” You may deny. This is the statement of a big psychologist. You can shake your head, but this is the scientific words by big psychologist. You can note down his name, Dr. W.S. Urquhart, professor of psychology in the Scottish Churches College in 1918-20.

The fact is Srila Prabhupada never appointed one single female TP and GBC says it all.....what to speak of being a Diksa Guru.

1) Hari-bhakti-vilasa (11.708) quotes from the Visnu Purana (3.12.30) (regarding how a grhastha should work in this world):

yosito navamanyeta
na casam visvased budhah
na caiversur bhavet tasu
nadhikuryat kadacana

“A wise man should never insult women, nor should he trust them. He should never become jealous of women, nor should he ever appoint them.”

“As for behavior, there are many rules and regulations guiding human behavior, such as the Manu-samhita, which is the law of the human race. Even up to today, those who are Hindu follow the Manu-samhita. Laws of inheritance and other legalities are derived from this book. Now, in the Manu-samhita it is clearly stated that a woman should not be given freedom. That does not mean that women are to be kept as slaves, but they are like children. Children are not given freedom, but that does not mean that they are kept as slaves. The demons have now neglected such injunctions, and they think that women should be given as much freedom as men. However, this has not improved the social condition of the world. Actually, a woman should be given protection at every stage of life. She should be given protection by the father in her younger days, by the husband in her youth, and by the grownup sons in her old age. This is proper social behavior according to the Manu-samhita. But modern education has artificially devised a puffed-up concept of womanly life, and therefore marriage is practically now an imagination in human society. Nor is the moral condition of woman very good now.” (Bg 16.7 purport)

“In the Manu-smrti it is stated that a woman should not be given independence, but should be given protection by her father, husband and elderly sons. In all circumstances a woman should remain dependent upon some guardian. Presently women are given full independence like men, but actually we can see that such independent women are no happier than those women who are placed under guardians. If people follow the injunctions given by the great sages, srutis and smrtis, they can actually be happy in both this life and the next. Unfortunately rascals are manufacturing so many ways and means to be happy. Everyone is inventing so many methods. Consequently human society has lost the standard ways of life, both materially and spiritually, and as a result people are bewildered, and there is no peace or happiness in the world. Although they are trying to solve the problems of human society in the United Nations, they are still baffled. Because they do not follow the liberated instructions of the Vedas, they are unhappy.” (Bhag. 4.18.3 purport)

www.prabhupadavani.org/main/Conversations/009.html

Actually, Dhruva Maharaja’s mother, Suniti, was his patha-pradarsaka-guru. Patha-pradarsaka-guru means “the guru, or the spiritual master, who shows the way.” Such a guru is sometimes called siksa-guru. Although Narada Muni was his diksa-guru (initiating spiritual master), Suniti, his mother, was the first who gave him instruction on how to achieve the favor of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. It is the duty of the siksa-guru or diksa-guru to instruct the disciple in the right way, and it depends on the disciple to execute the process. According to sastric injunctions, there is no difference between siksa-guru and diksa-guru, and generally the siksa-guru later on becomes the diksa-guru. Suniti, however, being a woman, and specifically his mother, could not become Dhruva Maharaja’s diksa-guru.” (Bhag. 4.12.32 purport)

There is few exceptiones:

Historical Examples of Female Gaudiya Diksa-gurus

a) Sita Thakurani—The wife of Advaita Prabhu. According to the Prema-vilasa (vilasa 24) of Nityananda Dasa, Sita Thakurani gave diksa (krsna-mantra) to her two servants Nandini and Jangali. The vaikuntha-svarupas of Nandini and Jangali are the well-known gatekeepers Jaya and Vijaya (Gaura-ganoddeSa-dipika text 89). Their disciple-ship to Sitadevi, along with other interesting facts, is corroborated in the well-known and respected compilation named Gaudiya-vaisnava abhidhana and in the Sita-caritra by Lokanatha Dasa.

b) Jahnava Thakurani – The wife of Nityananda Prabhu. Jahnava Thakurani became one of the greatest leaders of our tradition in its second generation. Virabhadra and Ramacandra, the sons (biological and adopted respectively) of Nityananda Prabhu, were two of the most famous among her initiated disciples.

“Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura writes in his Anubhasya, ‘Virabhadra Gosani was the direct son of Srila Nityananda Prabhu and a disciple of Jahnava Devi.’” (Caitanya-caritamrta Adi-lila 11.8 purport)

“Yadunandana Acarya’s wife, Laksmi, was a very humble and submissive lady. She had two beautiful daughters named Srimati and Narayani. By the arrangement of Sri ISvari (Jahnava Devi), these two girls became the fortunate wives of Viracandra Prabhu. On the day of the wedding, Yadunandana took initiation from Viracandra, and Sri Jahnava happily accepted Srimati and Narayani as her disciples.” (Bhakti-ratnakara, ch. 13)

She is also confirmed as a diksa-guru both in the Gaudiya-vaisnava abhidhana (pg. 1246-47) and in the Prema-vilasa of Nityananda Dasa (vilasas 15 & 20).

c) Hemalata Thakurani – The eldest daughter of Srinivasa Acarya. Hemalata Thakurani, a contemporary of Jahnava, was one of the prominent leaders of the tradition at her time. Among her disciples, Yadunandana, the author of Karnananda, is particularly well-known (see Karnananda [ch.2 &3] and the introduction [pg 12] to Krsna-karnamrta by Sambidananda Das Ph.D). She also had a wayward disciple named Rupa Kaviraja. (see Gaudiya-vaisnava abhidhana pg. 1422)

“Now the disciples of Sri Hemalata shall be described. Sri Suvala Chandra Thakura, and his nephew Sri Gokula Chakravarti were her disciples. Sri Radhavallava Thakura from Mandala village, Sri Vallavadasa of the Gosvami family, and Yadunandana Vaidya dasa of Malihati village were all disciples of Sri Isvari. Kanurama Chakravarti and his two servants Darpanayana and Candi, Ramacarana, Madhu Miswas, and Radha Kanta Vaidya were other disciples of Hemalata. Jagadisa Kaviraja and his follower, who was the brother of Radhavallabh Kaviraja were initiated by Hemalata.” (Karnananda, ch.2, last paragraph)

“One day my spiritual master, Sri Hemalata, revealed the glories of Ramacandra to me.” “I shall describe another episode which I heard from my guru, Sri Isvari Hemalata.” (Karnananda, ch.3)

d) Gauranga-priya Devi – The second wife and disciple of Srinivasa Acarya (Gaudiya-vaisnava abhidhana pg. 1224) She was from a Cakravarti brahmana family, her father being Raghunatha Cakravarti, a resident of West Gopalapura. She initiated a number of disciples, one being Gurucarana Dasa, who wrote a book at her behest called Premamrta which is based on the Prema-vilasa (Gaudiya-vaisnava abhidhana pg. 1203).

“Srinivasa Acarya’s first wife, Srimati ISvari Thakurani, was a highly devotional lady. Gauranga-priya, his second wife, also possessed exalted devotional qualities. In due course of time many persons became disciples of Srinivasa Acarya and his wives.”(Karnananda, ch.2)

e) Gangamata Gosvamini – A disciple of Haridasa Pandita Gosvami, the sevaite of Govindaji mentioned in Sri Caitanya-caritamrta. Among others, King Mukundadeva of Jagannatha Puri and a number of Lord Jagannatha’s sevaites received diksa from her. She was also an eloquent speaker and explained Srimad-Bhagavatam to large audiences. Gangamata Gosvamini’s case is further confirmation that a woman can be a guru in a bona fide Gaudiya Vaisnava line. At least up to her point in the line, the line was bona fide because her guru is confirmed by Srila Krsnadasa Kaviraja Gosvami in the Caitanya-caritamrta (Adi 8.60). Her acceptance of disciples is confirmed in Gaudiya-vaisnava abhidhana (pgs. 1197-98) and by the present day mahanta, Balarama Das Gosvami, at the Gangamata Gosvamini Matha in Puri.

After Ganga Mata Goswamini that floated on the Ganga in Puri there has not been any bonafide female Diksa Gurus in our Gaudiya line

Stri Dharma
Womens duties in Varna Asrama is described in few verses in Srimad Bhagavatam 7th canto chapter 11 :

Text 25: To render service to the husband, to be always favorably disposed toward the husband, to be equally well disposed toward the husband’s relatives and friends, and to follow the vows of the husband — these are the four principles to be followed by women described as chaste.

Texts 26-27: A chaste woman must dress nicely and decorate herself with golden ornaments for the pleasure of her husband. Always wearing clean and attractive garments, she should sweep and clean the household with water and other liquids so that the entire house is always pure and clean. She should collect the household paraphernalia and keep the house always aromatic with incense and flowers and must be ready to execute the desires of her husband. Being modest and truthful, controlling her senses, and speaking in sweet words, a chaste woman should engage in the service of her husband with love, according to time and circumstances.

Text 28: A chaste woman should not be greedy, but satisfied in all circumstances. She must be very expert in handling household affairs and should be fully conversant with religious principles. She should speak pleasingly and truthfully and should be very careful and always clean and pure. Thus a chaste woman should engage with affection in the service of a husband who is not fallen.

Text 29: The woman who engages in the service of her husband, following strictly in the footsteps of the goddess of fortune, surely returns home, back to Godhead, with her devotee husband, and lives very happily in the Vaikuṇṭha planets.

Srila Prabhupada engaged women in devotional service that transcend the bodily concept of life but did not make them leaders in ISKCON, Srila Prabhupada pointed out again and again women should be protected for further clarification please also see Srila Prabhupadas purport to Bhagavad Gita 1.40

TEXT 40
adharmabhibhavat krsna
pradusyanti kula-striyah
strisu dustasu varsneya
jayate varna-sankarah

SYNONYMS
adharma—irreligion; abhibhavat—having been predominant; krsna—O Krsna; pradusyanti—become polluted; kula-striyah—family ladies; strisu —of the womanhood; dustasu—being so polluted; varsneya—O descendant of Vrsni; jayate—it so becomes; varna-sankarah—unwanted progeny.

TRANSLATION
When irreligion is prominent in the family, O Krsna, the women of the family become corrupt, and from the degradation of womanhood, O descendant of Vrsni, comes unwanted progeny.

PURPORT
Good population in human society is the basic principle for peace, prosperity and spiritual progress in life. The varnasrama religion's principles were so designed that the good population would prevail in society for the general spiritual progress of state and community. Such population depends on the chastity and faithfulness of its womanhood. As children are very prone to be misled, women are similarly very prone to degradation. Therefore, both children and women require protection by the elder members of the family. By being engaged in various religious practices, women will not be misled into adultery. According to Canakya Pandit, women are generally not very intelligent and therefore not trustworthy. So, the different family traditions of religious activities should always engage them, and thus their chastity and devotion will give birth to a good population eligible for participating in the varnasrama system. On the failure of such varnasrama-dharma, naturally the women become free to act and mix with men, and thus adultery is indulged in at the risk of unwanted population. Irresponsible men also provoke adultery in society, and thus unwanted children flood the human race at the risk of war and pestilence.

Srila Prabhupada did not manufacture his own opinions in regards to womens duties as also seen in the commentaries of the Vaisnava Acaryas from all 4 Vaisnava Sampradayas :

Commentary by Sri Vishvanatha Chakravarthi Thakur of Gaudiya Sampradaya:
When adharma is prevalent, the women of the family will become spoiled (pradusyanti), by becoming adulterous.

Commentary by Sri Ramanuja of Sri Sampradaya:
1.26 – 1.47 Arjuna said — Sanjaya said — Sanjaya continued: The high-minded Arjuna, extremely kind, deeply friendly, and supremely righteous, having brothers like himself, though repeatedly deceived by the treacherous attempts of your people like burning in the lac-house etc., and therefore fit to be killed by him with the help of the Supreme Person, nevertheless said, ‘I will not fight.’ He felt weak, overcome as he was by his love and extreme compassion for his relatives. He was also filled with fear, not knowing what was righteous and what unrighteous. His mind was tortured by grief, because of the thought of future separation from his relations. So he threw away his bow and arrow and sat on the chariot as if to fast to death.

The Supreme Lord Krishna, Hrsikesa, the master of the senses. The Supreme Controller, internally and externally of all living entities evolving and evolved. Who although the Supreme Lord of all, yet descended down to Earth out of His causeless mercy for the redemption of the faithful and even more, He condescended to be Arjuna’s chariot driver, carrying out his wish to station their chariot in such a commanding position as to be able to readily view the belligerent Kauravas and put within the range of his vision such heroes as Bhishmadeva, Dronacarya and Kripa and the Kings of royal dynasties. At that time the Supreme Lord Krishna said to Arjuna: see what chances there are for the Kauravas victory over thee.

Commentary by Sri Sridhara Swami of Rudra Sampradaya:
The sinfulness alluded to in the previous verse leads to the degradation of the females in the family is being described here.

Commentary by Sri Madhvacharya of Brahma Sampradaya:
Sri Madhvacharya did not comment on this sloka.

Commentary by Sri Keshava Kashmiri of Kumara Sampradaya:
Deliberating further Arjuna determines that when unrighteousness becomes predominant in the family due to the loss of the father who insures the continuation of the family customs and the propagation of the Vedic tradition, the females of the family become easily accessible and are placed in conditions of compromise. From this polluted and degraded position arises undesirable progeny. The purpose of Arjuna addressing Lord Krishna by the vocative Varsneya is to remind Him that He took birth in the exalted royal Vrsni dynasty and as such should be fully aware of all these things.

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